Street poets VS. Academic poets
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsBRAVO Mike, and a spendid ditty it 'tis.... |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsIs there such a thing as a couch potato poet if so then I am one of them? |
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RE: RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsThank you both my dear friends gogant and Balladeer......plus all of my other dear awesome poet friends... Quote:
Originally Posted by Balladeer One does not need the fancy words, Asha.....read Sylvia Plath's DADDY and you'll know what I mean. The important thing in poetry is the emotion you are able to put into it. When you can transfer the passion from your body into your poem, people will know it. When you fake it, people will know that, too. Actually I wrote a small ditty to illustrate that point.... My poems may not be classics; They may never make the grade That separates the amateurs From masters of their trade. They may never reach anthologies Or even magazines, Or ever be considered masterful, By any means. They may go through Time unnoticed But, one thing I promise you, Is, whatever I may offer Is the best that I can do. There's a chance I'm not as gifted Or, as my ex-wife believed, That my father's sperm count faltered On the day I was conceived. Perhaps my grey cell count is lower Than another man's But, whenever I present myself, I do the best I can. A poem has integrity. It puts us on display. A testament of our beliefs Is there in what we say. Sincerity cannot be faked; Pride has no substitute. If we don't give it our best shot, Why take the time to shoot? Let's help enrich each other And this world in which we live. In poetry, and friendship, give The best that you can give. |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsDear ApaqRasgirl! Well said. Poetry is reaction to the environmental shocks that transform into feeings and thoughts. Any thing that tries to block the flow of feelings and thoughts cannot be appreciated. Rafiqam |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsDear gogant. You are correct because beauty lies in the thought mostly. Crafting with rules is good but giving it too much importance reduces it to carpentry orblcksmithy- Rafiqam |
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Stumbling Stone Removal SystemI really like what all is going on in this thread, |
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RE: Stumbling Stone Removal SystemBRAVO!!! my friend, you hit the nail on the head with this one........Our future would be so bleak in our love for poetry, without our young ones to continue the flow of great words yet unwritten, will then be their poetry, our legacy to leave for them, of words expressed our love of poetry. Quote: Originally Posted by WordSlinger I really like what all is going on in this thread, all Teachers here, poets/friends at the great table of poetry, discussing the infrastructure of poetry every one of you are amazing 21st Century poets, We the Poets, need to make the youth our priority, They are the heart of poetry Our title is meaningless without this There is only one way, and that is the Write-way They should be heard, along with being seen Some one please pass the turnip greens.... WS   
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Stumbling Stone Removal System
Last edited by WordSlinger 08-01-2010 at 11:13:38 AM |
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RE: Stumbling Stone Removal SystemThank you my awesome WorddddddddSlingerrrrrrrrr for this opportunity to meet greatness to come. Quote: :
Originally Posted by WordSlinger  Asha thanks, I hand drive, very well in roofing so I try, lolWe have a beautiful opportunity to change the world one by one, and poetry seems to me the best tool we have. Tears roll down my face, because when I was 17, poetry saved my life, so I am sure it can save others, and think, without the net, and OP, the process would be slow. So I guess we need to grind slow, meaning never to forget, where we come from, We have a young poet here, named Helios, he has a poem that needs our love, please read, and comment what you feel is right, Gosh them greens are good, more please. Le Vampyre , by Helios http://www.originalpoetry.com/le-vyre |
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RE: Stumbling Stone Removal SystemQuote: Originally Posted by WordSlinger I really like what all is going on in this thread, all Teachers here, poets/friends at the great table of poetry, discussing the infrastructure of poetry every one of you are amazing 21st Century poets, We the Poets, need to make the youth our priority, They are the heart of poetry Our title is meaningless without this There is only one way, and that is the Write-way They should be heard, along with being seen Some one please pass the turnip greens.... WS Arise Gifted Poet Arise! Arise gifted poet as a flaming bird from the ashes of your estate, an estate in the moment as eternity. Lift, lift, lift— above the trees of shady time. Soar above the hills of your newly found home to grasp the clouds. Sing the voice of the present wrapped in your grief. Uplift your eyes, Uplift them; let them walk through the cumulous white sky— Frame by frame in flames—a music in the making fixed with that new freed song standing before you in the mirrored self. To lastly alight in your present dream still discovering you. Land, land now on the laden fruit tree in the orchard where life's abundant fruition fruits forth with it's full roundness and sweet meat upon the tongue. Feel the drips of newly bitten flesh slide down your cheeks. Leave only, only the core attached to the stem. For without knowing your words, your breaths, you have become— Become liberated from the cage of that ancient heart wood. You've changed. © RH Peat 5/31/2010 10:56Pm From free verse. 25 lines. |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poets
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The Poetry FeminaissanceThis is a very great article a must read. |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poets
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RE: RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsQuote: Originally Posted by rsalassi And another thing!!! All poets, indeed, all writers draw their material from experiences and observations. If one has a bit of formal education in the area of poetry, then it's simply part of his experience, So what? If one has no formal education in the area of poetry, so what, again? It does not matter one way or the other. Now there are good poets and bad poets, but even that is subjective. There's a particular contributor on OP whose name I won't reveal (J.L) whose poetry is utter SHIT! in my opinion. But I'm sure he has many devotees who think he's the cat's meow! So what? There are several (perhaps, legions!) who regard my little verses as poop. So what? But to start listing people and labelling them as to which camp they belong sends me over the edge!!! Who are any of us to pontificate so? I rarely read bits posted in the Forum, and I have a good reason. Much of it is pure puffery, and this so-called topic is no exception! Although I think it could of been expressed much more eloquently with more tact and less anger ( good lord man take a pill or something ) I have to agree with much of what rsalassi has to say on this topic. Everything is subjective to taste and our own paticular life experiences. I have a real issues with applying labels to this is this or that type of poetry or music or art in general. Art is among other things.. : the conscious use of skill and creative imagination especially in the production of aesthetic objects; also decorative or illustrative elements in printed matter and . : skill acquired by experience, study, or observation So....it is what it is. I also have to agree with the fact that at one time those artist who are now being defined as classic or academic were at that time in history the new voices of that time. They expressed what they observed. They expressed it in the way that was phoneticly (if thats even a word) common for that time and in the forum or medium that was common for that time. Just as we (word warriors that we are) do here on this web site and other sites on our common forum or medium of the day.....the internet. So 40 50 60 years from now our poetry will be considered the classic and a new form of poetry will emerge telling the poets of the futures stories and observations in a forum or medium that we don't even have a clue about today....... So enjoy what you enjoy.... take from it what you need or want........and stop trying to compare and label what is ART and all that word defines. WORD  Need to add one thing......I value and appriciate all writers on this website for the honesty and willingness to rise above our different points of view to do what it is we all are here to do........experience the observations of others lives through written word and to express our own. I find it to be the part of my day I most look forward to. And all our words are relevant and important and will someday be part of a historic anthology. Last edited by JadedJezzabel 08-12-2010 at 08:52:02 PM |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsReminds me of the self - tailored outlook some of the posting display regarding guitar players.e.g.= "This guy,no question, is hands down the best guitar player in rock and roll." |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsPoetry can only be rated by the reader. I write so many different ways. I even write obituaries. It isn't a sad thing. I supply the family with a wonderful last thought of their loveone. Funerals are really empty. I feel very appreciated. Poetry is a gift to some. Please let me share this with all of you. |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsVery nice! I kinda have a Santa's workshop image running in the background as I read it. And then perhaps the vision of the seven dwarfs whistling Hi- Ho, Hi-Ho. |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsI think and I'm sure of myself now that I'm a street poet but before I really don't know where I'm belong...thanks for discussing that topic... (",) Last edited by amamimichiyo 09-02-2010 at 10:48:07 AM |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsI find this video/movie beautiful... Last edited by WordSlinger 11-04-2010 at 10:59:19 AM |
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RE: RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsQuote: Originally Posted by rsalassi I find the questions you pose to be simply bullshit. Street poets? Academic poets? Bullshit!! Poetry cannot be divided into camps as warring factions pitted against each other. Now there's good poetry and, well, the not so good. I find your position demeaning to all poets, regardless of what you consider yourself! Thanks for saying what needed to be said. Maybe I'm humble or maybe I just suck but half the time I have a hard time considering what I even write to be poetry. |
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RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsQuote:
Originally Posted by ThoughtCaster This is a multi-topic question. First who do you admire/are influenced by most- street poets or academic poets? Or Both? The academic poets seem to me more concept oriented-fancy words(sacrificing thought over emotion), etc. while the street poets have always depicted more real life-more emotion. I consider myself somewhere in between as I have more of a street poets sense of life yet still an academic use of language sometimes. Examples of academic poets: Walt Whitman Robert Frost T.S. Elliot Emerson Poe(?) (and archaic poets) Shakespeare Byron Shelley Blake Street Poets: Jim Carroll(the best street poet) Charles Bukowski Michael Madsen(yes, the actor) Rod McKuen(more confessional) and the in betweens: Jim Morrison(of the Doors- (3 books of poetry) Erica Jong David Berman and also a third group-the songwriter poets Bob Dylan(no doubt his lyrics are poetry) Michael Stipe(of R.E.M.)-again abstract and poetic Fish(Derek William Dick of the band Marillion-his lyrics are definitely poetic) Paul Simon Patti Smith(the female punk poetess) Tupac Shakur Pink Floyd Trent Reznor(of Nine Inch Nails) Tori Amos John Lennon etc. So what type of poet do you consider yourself? What are your feelings on academic versus street poetry versus lyric poetry? What are your thoughts on the different types/styles?[/quote *********************************************************************************************************** [b] I consider my self an academic poet. However, I love to read various types of poetry. except what is called "dub" poetry in Jamaica, which is focussed on coarse suggestions and sometimes coarse language in defence of reality ,freedom of speech and justice for the underdog and the underprivileged. Not that I am against what are dubbers' or GJs' laments, but their stylistics, stereotyped rhythms or monotone often piss me off. Mutabaruka of Jamaica is one of the best at so-called street poetry, but often, his poems possess a literary quality or veneer which makes it a controversial issue as to whether he writes academic or street poetry. Mutabaruka simplifies the problem, by declaring that he writes dub poetry as the best posture to voice human misery and injustice, and as the most powerful advocate or instrument of appeal for love. peace and justice. . [/b] Last edited by cousinsoren 11-06-2010 at 11:41:55 AM |
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RE: RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsQuote: [/b]
Originally Posted by Balladeer So which is better...street or academic? I'm not sure there is a difference. The poets that we look upon now might well have been the street poets of their day. It was a different world back then. On the other hand, the street poets of today may well have expanded the knowledge and training they got by studying the academic poets. They are all different parts of the same animal. Just as an actor can be dramatic, a bit player, or a comedian. so can poets be any style they choose. They are all poets. I shy away from questions like, "Which poetry is better?" because it all depends on the person. A person simply needs to find the form that suits him/her the best and write on! Whichever style one employs to get his message across in the best possible way is the right form for him. I wrote a poem some time ago to illustrate this point... "My Lord", the Queen said, "by your leave I've written down a rhyme And would be proud for you to comment on, should you have time. I've woven quite a tapestry of images that sing A message that I feel would be befitting for a king." "A rhyme?", the King said. "Lady, there is nothing I hate worse Than silly little couplets forced together into verse! Pure prose alone is strong enough to make a message clear And not this childish ditty that you dare to offer here." Just then the castle doors sprung wide and, entering from the night, A young man rushed, quite out of breath with features full of fright. "My King!", he cried. "The armies of our foes are on the march! They're pillaging the villages with saber, lance and torch." "Our legions need men and supplies. Please do not hesitate Or, by this time tomorrow, they'll be at the castle gate!" The King reacted quickly. Reinforcements were dispatched And, by the eve, the tide had turned...the danger met and matched. That evening in the royal bed, the Queen quite sweetly, said "That boy who warned us of the fight-was his hair blond...or red?" "What's this?", replied the King. "What nonsense do I hear from you?" "That boy", she said, "who came today. Were his eyes brown...or blue?" "Was his body big and strong...or was it rather small? Were his features pale or sunburned? Did you find him short or tall? Did you spy rings on his fingers or a chain around his neck? When he moved, did he bend down a bit or did he stand erect?" "My Queen, you've truly gone insane to ask such foolish things. I care not if he had ORANGE eyes...or if he wore TEN rings! I care not how he walked...care not what color horse he mounted! The boy held no signifigance - the message was what counted!" "My lord", the Queen said, "by your leave, I've written down a rhyme And would be proud for you to comment on, should you have time......" The King smiled. In his eye, a humorous twinkle could be seen. He said, "I am a lucky man to have such a wonderous Queen." %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Yeah, Balladeer. your argument is clear and well balanced. It is often difficult to categorize some poetry, since some poems seem to project an hybrid of academic and street qualities,for example, the poetry of Jamaica's most prominent . dub poet, Mutabaruka. Last edited by cousinsoren 11-06-2010 at 02:19:20 PM |
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RE: RE: RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsQuote: Originally Posted by ApaqRasgirl Thank you both my dear friends gogant and Balladeer......plus all of my other dear awesome poet friends... From me to all of you, dear friends Sometimes I like to rhyme.... I always try to express... What I feel in my life... Heart, body & soul, is best... Or events in my daily plight... Things I have seen today... The reasons I write, could go on and on... But the important things I wish to say... I always express true feelings, no con... What I say might make you laugh, cry or sigh... If they did then I succeeded... Once more without a fight... To bring forth all that is needed... Sometimes I like not to rhyme.... What came from me into the words... Does not always have to rhyme... To show how much I love... Putting pen to paper each day... So I do not need big fancy words contemplated... To get my feelings out into the light... Maybe a mystical magic array of dreams... Fairy tales of lovers spirits soaring... My joy in writing poetry... Oops I let slip a fancy word above... I can express as well to my friends... With my eye pressed to the lens of my camera... Seeking natures beauty has no ends of glory... The love for each fills my heart with bliss... To share both equally with my friends... The rest is just fatter for the birds... Cause I am but a simple country girl... From the mountains of Tennessee... A loving heart for all my friends, gives me such a thrill... Can't you see, it's all just poetry... loves ya all bunches asha      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Way to go, Asha. You have expressed the feelings of 90% of the poets on this site, and I applaud you for your bravery... ohh................................................................gogant ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~` Originally Posted by Balladeer One does not need the fancy words, Asha.....read Sylvia Plath's DADDY and you'll know what I mean. The important thing in poetry is the emotion you are able to put into it. When you can transfer the passion from your body into your poem, people will know it. When you fake it, people will know that, too. Actually I wrote a small ditty to illustrate that point.... My poems may not be classics; They may never make the grade That separates the amateurs From masters of their trade. They may never reach anthologies Or even magazines, Or ever be considered masterful, By any means. They may go through Time unnoticed But, one thing I promise you, Is, whatever I may offer Is the best that I can do. There's a chance I'm not as gifted Or, as my ex-wife believed, That my father's sperm count faltered On the day I was conceived. Perhaps my grey cell count is lower Than another man's But, whenever I present myself, I do the best I can. A poem has integrity. It puts us on display. A testament of our beliefs Is there in what we say. Sincerity cannot be faked; Pride has no substitute. If we don't give it our best shot, Why take the time to shoot? Let's help enrich each other And this world in which we live. In poetry, and friendship, give The best that you can give. &&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&& You have spoken well, Balladeer. There is no yardstick nor scales nor chemical tests to determine which is absolutely academic and which is absolutely street poetry.. Just as how there is no bad nor good poetry, only good and bad poets, good and bad critics, good and bad audiences, so there is neither academic nor street poetry, but academic and street poets and so on. Fine feathers often do not make fine birds, but gold lies hidden in crude ore. . [/b] Last edited by cousinsoren 11-06-2010 at 08:36:13 AM |
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RE: RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsQuote: Originally Posted by castlemist I hate to categorize anything to tell you the truth. I think the mark of good poetry or lyrics is the how much imagery, thought, and feeling it provokes with minimal words. When I think acedemic, I see folks who are pretentious, long winded and who try to impress folks with obsure words...I just don't get what people see in some of the last centuries "great" poets. Hank Williams touched more souls than TS Elliot. When I think street, I think forced rhymes and commercial shallowness such as much of the hip/hop - rap I hear. Shock and vulgarity grow old after a while. But, that being said, there's a lot of good stuff out there including the classics and the folks on this website. Just remember, most famous poets are only known for one or two pieces and are only read in anthologies. Maybe we'll all get lucky enough to land in one someday. Sorry...guess I strayed somewhat off topic  &&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&& You and I preach the same gospel from the same pulpit, in the same voice, Castlemist.....................................LOL 
Last edited by cousinsoren 11-06-2010 at 08:40:02 AM |
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RE: RE: Street poets VS. Academic poetsQuote: Originally Posted by WordSlinger WWWorrrrrrdddsssslllllllliiiinnnngggggggerrrr is a poet with 4 wheel drive, so lets go for a ride. WARNING!!! RECITE @ YOUR OWN RISK WARNING!!! .... I have written (self taught) Poetry since 15 October 1987, until recently I am studying the greats, and have started the School here on OP. I have rounded up the teachers via the net. Kabbalistic, RHPeat, Neville, Oren, Thought Caster, Balladeer, Rhafam. I only done this to add to our tool box( training), my fellow citizens here on OP. Don't worry, I won't loose the old school WordSlinger feel. I just want to add more to the 21st Century deal, lol I create poems in all genres so don't trip!.... I have to take the road that Bruce Lee took towards the Martial Arts, as an Analogy here. Like Water; I take the Literature Arts of Poetry. In the beginning I used free verse, swift rhyming, lyrical, rap-groove verse. With definition and aggression. Now I try deferent systems , in all genres, as always, And put them to my personal use, furthermore put to use what is useful when needed, and reject what I dont need at the time for a specific write. Using no specific way is the way, I am the way I write, but keeping in mind, the tools at hand. No limitations as the limitation. With all poetry styles ( trapping, and grabbing )-(Mind locks-Heart locks-Spiritual locks-) Honestly expressing ones self is difficult to do: The Poet, the creating individual is always more important than any style or system. Absorb what is useful, discard what is useless, And add to what is your own. I write my own interpretation of poetry. Concepts behind concepts. Dedicating to creating creative new-original thoughts, and poetry. Like I write with one hand, but if I could write with the other, at the same time, a different poem, that would be to break boundaries. As asking multi-tasking: Poetry styles separate poets. Style is a continuous growth. Poetry skills/tools are weapons and you have to use all of them, to incorporate all styles. (Move all parts of your poetry) Put everything into it, all energy. Rest then progress. A true poet is constantly growing, and when he or she are bound by a set of styles, or a way of doing things, thats when he stops growing. To reach a reader you have to move to them, advance, and retreat- advance retreat, furthermore slide and step back, push, and push back, circle them ( put the reader on defense),and close them in, and hit them with the best closure. Poetry is like water, flexible, it has to go somewhere. Currently I am here, studying your American Poetry Past and Present Class: This study thread is amazing with Highlighted notes, impressive book. http://www.originalpoetry.com/forum/view/topic/topic_id/3910#16008 
Hey, reality is what you can get away with so don't believe any of this post , but then again a spirit is a spirit isn't it Treacherous urges steadily spur on this dreadful adventure of what we lure! ~ In the Poets' hood keep the Poets' eye- For a good Poet shall never die! ********************************************************************************************************* You and I, John Wordslinger, are preaching the same gospel, from the same pulpit. I cannot write street poetry simply because I am an academic. However, I shall quarrel with no one who claims that some of my poetry is street poetry. In my thinking, there is neither academic poetry nor street poetry. Just as how there is neither good nor bad poetry,only good and bad poets, good and bad critics. good and bad audiences , good and bad readers of poetry, similarly , there is neither academic nor street poetry, but academic poets and street poets and so on.................
Last edited by cousinsoren 11-06-2010 at 09:06:31 AM |
In science one tries to tell people, in such a way as to be understood by everyone, something that no one ever knew before. But in poetry, it's the exact opposite.
Franz Kafka (1883-1924) Czech writer.